Hierarchy separator recommendation?
Dear dovecot list,
I'm using Maildir as mailbox format.
Is there any recommendation for the namespace hierarchy separator?
Currently I didn't set any. So it is the default of dot '.'
I'm switiching from a rather unknown IMAP Server called DBMail (http://www.dbmail.org/) Planning to synchronize the mailboxes via imapsync (https://github.com/imapsync/imapsync)
Is there anything I should be thinking / planning about?
Or can i always change this namespace hierarchy separator later on?
Any hints or insights are more than welcome ;)
thanks & greetings Becki
On 24. Apr 2020, at 15.27, Admin Beckspaced <admin@beckspaced.com> wrote:
Dear dovecot list,
I'm using Maildir as mailbox format.
Is there any recommendation for the namespace hierarchy separator?
Currently I didn't set any. So it is the default of dot '.'
this should work.
I'm switiching from a rather unknown IMAP Server called DBMail (http://www.dbmail.org/) Planning to synchronize the mailboxes via imapsync (https://github.com/imapsync/imapsync)
Please be aware that imapsync does not migrate all data. It loses UID and POP3UIDL information. If you plan to keep on using the same domain, then you need to instruct your end users to invalidate the local caches on their devices. With most client applications means removing and readding account and redownloading all emails. (or atleast headers)
Or can i always change this namespace hierarchy separator later on?
This would cause similar caching problems on end user devices.
Sami
Hello Sami,
thanks a lot for your reply and sharing your thoughts.
glad to know that it should work ... ... will report back if something goes wrong ;)
greetings Becki
Am 24.04.2020 um 14:56 schrieb Sami Ketola:
On 24. Apr 2020, at 15.27, Admin Beckspaced <admin@beckspaced.com> wrote:
Dear dovecot list,
I'm using Maildir as mailbox format.
Is there any recommendation for the namespace hierarchy separator?
Currently I didn't set any. So it is the default of dot '.' this should work.
I'm switiching from a rather unknown IMAP Server called DBMail (http://www.dbmail.org/) Planning to synchronize the mailboxes via imapsync (https://github.com/imapsync/imapsync)
Please be aware that imapsync does not migrate all data. It loses UID and POP3UIDL information. If you plan to keep on using the same domain, then you need to instruct your end users to invalidate the local caches on their devices. With most client applications means removing and readding account and redownloading all emails. (or atleast headers)
Or can i always change this namespace hierarchy separator later on? This would cause similar caching problems on end user devices.
Sami
The dot '.' will work, but I suggest to follow documentation here: https://wiki1.dovecot.org/Namespaces,
And it says:
A commonly used separator is '/'. It probably causes the least amount of trouble with different IMAP clients
And I already had problems using '.' as a namespace separator.
On 2020-04-24 15:56, Sami Ketola wrote:
On 24. Apr 2020, at 15.27, Admin Beckspaced <admin@beckspaced.com> wrote:
Dear dovecot list,
I'm using Maildir as mailbox format.
Is there any recommendation for the namespace hierarchy separator?
Currently I didn't set any. So it is the default of dot '.' this should work.
I'm switiching from a rather unknown IMAP Server called DBMail (http://www.dbmail.org/) Planning to synchronize the mailboxes via imapsync (https://github.com/imapsync/imapsync)
Please be aware that imapsync does not migrate all data. It loses UID and POP3UIDL information. If you plan to keep on using the same domain, then you need to instruct your end users to invalidate the local caches on their devices. With most client applications means removing and readding account and redownloading all emails. (or atleast headers)
Or can i always change this namespace hierarchy separator later on? This would cause similar caching problems on end user devices.
Sami
Hello Edgaras,
what sort of troubles did you run into with the dot '.' as namespace separator?
thanks & greetings Becki
Am 24.04.2020 um 15:32 schrieb Edgaras Lukoševičius:
The dot '.' will work, but I suggest to follow documentation here: https://wiki1.dovecot.org/Namespaces,
And it says:
A commonly used separator is '/'. It probably causes the least amount of trouble with different IMAP clients
And I already had problems using '.' as a namespace separator.
On 2020-04-24 15:56, Sami Ketola wrote:
On 24. Apr 2020, at 15.27, Admin Beckspaced <admin@beckspaced.com> wrote:
Dear dovecot list,
I'm using Maildir as mailbox format.
Is there any recommendation for the namespace hierarchy separator?
Currently I didn't set any. So it is the default of dot '.' this should work.
I'm switiching from a rather unknown IMAP Server called DBMail (http://www.dbmail.org/) Planning to synchronize the mailboxes via imapsync (https://github.com/imapsync/imapsync)
Please be aware that imapsync does not migrate all data. It loses UID and POP3UIDL information. If you plan to keep on using the same domain, then you need to instruct your end users to invalidate the local caches on their devices. With most client applications means removing and readding account and redownloading all emails. (or atleast headers)
Or can i always change this namespace hierarchy separator later on? This would cause similar caching problems on end user devices.
Sami
Hello Becki,
On 24.04.20 17:56, Admin Beckspaced wrote:
what sort of troubles did you run into with the dot '.' as namespace separator?
disadvantages could be:
- shared folders with dots in user names
- if you want to use dots in folder names
Whenever possible I use '/'.
Kind regards, Markus
thanks a lot for your input! So I better use '/' then ;)
Greetings Becki
Am 24.04.2020 um 19:10 schrieb Markus Winkler:
Hello Becki,
On 24.04.20 17:56, Admin Beckspaced wrote:
what sort of troubles did you run into with the dot '.' as namespace separator?
disadvantages could be:
- shared folders with dots in user names
- if you want to use dots in folder names
Whenever possible I use '/'.
Kind regards, Markus
On 24.04.20 17:56, Admin Beckspaced wrote:
what sort of troubles did you run into with the dot '.' as namespace separator?
disadvantages could be:
- shared folders with dots in user names
- if you want to use dots in folder names
What disadvantages are when using '/' as namespace separator?
Why is '.' default (at least in .deb packages) if it is worse then '/' ?
Doesn't it, in the end, all come to translation from IMAP names (user,folder) to OS filesystem names within dovecot (at some benchmark tests expense) ? :-)
Hi Ivo,
On 26.04.20 12:02, Ivo wrote:
disadvantages could be:
- shared folders with dots in user names
- if you want to use dots in folder names
What disadvantages are when using '/' as namespace separator?
IMHO: none. ;-) It depends, as always - YMMV.
Why is '.' default (at least in .deb packages) if it is worse then '/' ?
I assume: for historical reasons.
Doesn't it, in the end, all come to translation from IMAP names (user,folder) to OS filesystem names within dovecot (at some benchmark tests expense) ? :-)
No, as there's a difference between "namespace / hierarchy" (mailbox name) and "layout" separators (OS filesystem).
Regards, Markus
On 26/04/2020 13:17 Markus Winkler <ml@irmawi.de> wrote:
Hi Ivo,
On 26.04.20 12:02, Ivo wrote:
disadvantages could be:
- shared folders with dots in user names
- if you want to use dots in folder names
What disadvantages are when using '/' as namespace separator?
IMHO: none. ;-) It depends, as always - YMMV.
Why is '.' default (at least in .deb packages) if it is worse then '/' ?
I assume: for historical reasons.
Doesn't it, in the end, all come to translation from IMAP names (user,folder) to OS filesystem names within dovecot (at some benchmark tests expense) ? :-)
No, as there's a difference between "namespace / hierarchy" (mailbox name) and "layout" separators (OS filesystem).
Regards, Markus
Using dot breaks shared forlders if your usernames contain dot.
Aki
Hi Aki,
On 26.04.20 12:30, Aki Tuomi wrote:
Using dot breaks shared forlders if your usernames contain dot.
yes, I know and as I already wrote two days ago:
disadvantages could be:
- shared folders with dots in user names
- if you want to use dots in folder names
;-)
Regards, Markus
On 26.4.2020. 12:17, Markus Winkler wrote:
Doesn't it, in the end, all come to translation from IMAP names (user,folder) to OS filesystem names within dovecot (at some benchmark tests expense) ? :-)
No, as there's a difference between "namespace / hierarchy" (mailbox name) and "layout" separators (OS filesystem).
Hi Markus,
I was trying to write wannabe-joke / philosophical / theoretical comment. It seems that I failed :-(
What I tried to say is something like this : If some character is forbidden for usage in file or folder name in your OS who stands in your way to "escape it" or use mappings e.g. use 9ca6aead2310a010cf445099d8c731490329f9af (result of SHA1('Markus.Winkler')) instead of Markus.Winkler if '.' creates a problem. You need just one additional file to record mapping info and some CPU cycles / IO operations to do mappings every time you need to access it (hence mentioning benchmark tests). Yes, admins would "love" that and yes, this comment had no real value for dovecot users. Sorry.
Have a nice day,
Ivo.
On 24 Apr 2020, at 12:19, Admin Beckspaced <admin@beckspaced.com> wrote:
So I better use '/' then 😉
Only if you plan on having shared folders with . in the name or your users for some reason require having periods in the names of IMAP folders.
Both of these cases are not impossible, but seem to be extremely unlikely so far.
-- "Are you pondering what I'm pondering?" "I think so, Brain, but if we give peas a chance, won't the lima beans feel left out?”
participants (7)
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＠lbutlr
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Admin Beckspaced
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Aki Tuomi
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Edgaras Lukoševičius
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Ivo
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Markus Winkler
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Sami Ketola