Hi list owner,
Sorry for this.
Is it possible to change the reply-to in mailman to be the list, and not the person who replied?
Also the [Dovecot] on the subject would be handy.
Just two things to get better.
Thanks,
Am 14.10.2014 um 10:28 schrieb Jorge Bastos:
Sorry for this.
Is it possible to change the reply-to in mailman to be the list, and not the person who replied?
just use "reply to list"
Also the [Dovecot] on the subject would be handy
no - type "yahoo lists DMARC" in Google as well as the subject header my be DKIM signed
On 2014-10-14 10:28, Jorge Bastos wrote:
Is it possible to change the reply-to in mailman to be the list, and not the person who replied?
Every good MUA has a possibility for replying to the list. Also read http://www.unicom.com/pw/reply-to-harmful.html
Also the [Dovecot] on the subject would be handy.
Nope, I disagree. If you need to filter, there is a header for this:
List-Id: Dovecot Mailing List
Moritz
On Tue, 14 Oct 2014 10:33:55 +0200 Moritz Augsburger ml+dovecot@moritz.augsburger.name wrote:
On 2014-10-14 10:28, Jorge Bastos wrote:
Is it possible to change the reply-to in mailman to be the list, and not the person who replied?
Every good MUA has a possibility for replying to the list. Also read http://www.unicom.com/pw/reply-to-harmful.html
The preceding link is the opinion of one guy, and is no discussion ender. He makes up an ugly sounding characterization "munge", and I counter with the better sounding characterization "discussionize".
A mailing list is meant to produce a whole greater than the sum of the parts, not a bunch of people whispering privately in each others' ear, and therefore the default should go back to the mailing list. I'm soooo tired of seeing Chip Rosenthal's tired rant about reply-to redirection quoted as if it's something more than one guy's opinion.
For me, personally, the point is moot, because from my Claws-Mail on Debian Wheezy Linux, both Reply to List and Reply send it back to the list, and I must use Reply to Sender to send to the sender, which is the exact behavior I find best for a mailing list.
The original poster (OP) was using MS Outlook. Does anyone know how to "reply to list" in Outlook? If not, does Thunderbird have a "reply to list"? If so, the OP could switch to Thunderbird.
Also the [Dovecot] on the subject would be handy.
Nope, I disagree. If you need to filter, there is a header for this: List-Id: Dovecot Mailing List
I've been very pleased with the results ever since I started filtering mailing lists by List-Id instead of a marker in the subject line. It keeps everything going to the right mailboxes, even when crossposts are involved. I use the very versatile procmail for filtering; I'm not sure the OP's MS Outlook can do that. But, of course, Outlook has much more serious issues than any of this: I'd recommend the OP use a different mail client, for the security of his computer.
SteveT
Steve Litt * http://www.troubleshooters.com/ Troubleshooting Training * Human Performance
Am 14.10.2014 um 16:35 schrieb Steve Litt:
On Tue, 14 Oct 2014 10:33:55 +0200 Moritz Augsburger ml+dovecot@moritz.augsburger.name wrote:
On 2014-10-14 10:28, Jorge Bastos wrote:
Is it possible to change the reply-to in mailman to be the list, and not the person who replied?
Every good MUA has a possibility for replying to the list. Also read http://www.unicom.com/pw/reply-to-harmful.html
The preceding link is the opinion of one guy, and is no discussion ender. He makes up an ugly sounding characterization "munge", and I counter with the better sounding characterization "discussionize".
which happens currently
A mailing list is meant to produce a whole greater than the sum of the parts, not a bunch of people whispering privately in each others' ear, and therefore the default should go back to the mailing list. I'm soooo tired of seeing Chip Rosenthal's tired rant about reply-to redirection quoted as if it's something more than one guy's opinion.
not only one guy, you get on many lists a complaint for "reply all", reply private and so on - to quote another owner of a list about mailserver software "fix your mailclient"
For me, personally, the point is moot, because from my Claws-Mail on Debian Wheezy Linux, both Reply to List and Reply send it back to the list, and I must use Reply to Sender to send to the sender, which is the exact behavior I find best for a mailing list.
The original poster (OP) was using MS Outlook. Does anyone know how to "reply to list" in Outlook? If not, does Thunderbird have a "reply to list"? If so, the OP could switch to Thunderbird.
surely - and that's why i hate "reply all" because depending on which copy is faster i get the button enabled or not
Also the [Dovecot] on the subject would be handy.
Nope, I disagree. If you need to filter, there is a header for this: List-Id: Dovecot Mailing List
I've been very pleased with the results ever since I started filtering mailing lists by List-Id instead of a marker in the subject line. It keeps everything going to the right mailboxes, even when crossposts are involved. I use the very versatile procmail for filtering; I'm not sure the OP's MS Outlook can do that. But, of course, Outlook has much more serious issues than any of this: I'd recommend the OP use a different mail client, for the security of his computer
we are on a *mailserver list* and the server supports sieve
On 14.10.2014 16:35, Steve Litt wrote:
On Tue, 14 Oct 2014 10:33:55 +0200 Moritz Augsburger ml+dovecot@moritz.augsburger.name wrote:
On 2014-10-14 10:28, Jorge Bastos wrote:
Is it possible to change the reply-to in mailman to be the list, and not the person who replied? Every good MUA has a possibility for replying to the list. Also read http://www.unicom.com/pw/reply-to-harmful.html The preceding link is the opinion of one guy, and is no discussion ender. He makes up an ugly sounding characterization "munge", and I counter with the better sounding characterization "discussionize".
A mailing list is meant to produce a whole greater than the sum of the parts, not a bunch of people whispering privately in each others' ear, and therefore the default should go back to the mailing list. I'm soooo tired of seeing Chip Rosenthal's tired rant about reply-to redirection quoted as if it's something more than one guy's opinion.
For me, personally, the point is moot, because from my Claws-Mail on Debian Wheezy Linux, both Reply to List and Reply send it back to the list, and I must use Reply to Sender to send to the sender, which is the exact behavior I find best for a mailing list.
Also the [Dovecot] on the subject would be handy. Nope, I disagree. If you need to filter, there is a header for this: List-Id: Dovecot Mailing List
I've been very pleased with the results ever since I started filtering mailing lists by List-Id instead of a marker in the subject line. It keeps everything going to the right mailboxes, even when crossposts are involved. I use the very versatile procmail for filtering; I'm not sure The original poster (OP) was using MS Outlook. Does anyone know how to "reply to list" in Outlook? If not, does Thunderbird have a "reply to list"? If so, the OP could switch to Thunderbird. Of course Thunderbird has reply to list option the OP's MS Outlook can do that. But, of course, Outlook has much more serious issues than any of this: I'd recommend the OP use a different mail client, for the security of his computer.
SteveT
Steve Litt * http://www.troubleshooters.com/ Troubleshooting Training * Human Performance
Am 14.10.2014 um 18:43 schrieb Przemysław Orzechowski:
Of course Thunderbird has reply to list option
and if there is no sieve on the server you may define a filter in Thunderbird, guees its the same with outlook
see pics in
https://sys4.de/de/blog/2014/04/12/thunderbird-filter-list-id/
Best Regards MfG Robert Schetterer
-- [*] sys4 AG
http://sys4.de, +49 (89) 30 90 46 64 Franziskanerstraße 15, 81669 München
Sitz der Gesellschaft: München, Amtsgericht München: HRB 199263 Vorstand: Patrick Ben Koetter, Marc Schiffbauer Aufsichtsratsvorsitzender: Florian Kirstein
Am 14.10.2014 um 10:28 schrieb Jorge Bastos:
Hi list owner,
Sorry for this.
Is it possible to change the reply-to in mailman to be the list, and not the person who replied?
Also the [Dovecot] on the subject would be handy.
Just two things to get better.
Thanks,
might brake dkim and dmarc, filter with list-id
Best Regards MfG Robert Schetterer
-- [*] sys4 AG
http://sys4.de, +49 (89) 30 90 46 64 Franziskanerstraße 15, 81669 München
Sitz der Gesellschaft: München, Amtsgericht München: HRB 199263 Vorstand: Patrick Ben Koetter, Marc Schiffbauer Aufsichtsratsvorsitzender: Florian Kirstein
On 10/14/2014 1:28 AM, Jorge Bastos wrote:
Also the [Dovecot] on the subject would be handy.
The list used to do this. I agree with you, and the matter was debated, but the list is not a democracy and Timo, as the owner, changed the list unilaterally.
The problem is that changing the subject conflicts with DKIM. DKIM is a broken standard for several reasons; it does not have allowances for mailing lists to add their name to the subject - a very common and useful practice - and these days spam filters do a far superior job than DKIM, making it too little, too late. I do not use DKIM and get no spam. That last spam I got was about 4 months ago, then another 2 months before that. 2 spams over the course of 6 months is pretty good, and that is without DKIM.
Depending on your mail client, you can set up a filter that detects the mailing-list headers and adds the name back to the subject line. I do something similar and it adds back the lost functionality. :-)
Best of luck.
Dem
Am 14.10.2014 um 11:02 schrieb Professa Dementia:
On 10/14/2014 1:28 AM, Jorge Bastos wrote:
Also the [Dovecot] on the subject would be handy.
The list used to do this. I agree with you, and the matter was debated, but the list is not a democracy and Timo, as the owner, changed the list unilaterally.
The problem is that changing the subject conflicts with DKIM. DKIM is a broken standard for several reasons; it does not have allowances for mailing lists to add their name to the subject - a very common and useful practice - and these days spam filters do a far superior job than DKIM, making it too little, too late
nonsense because that spamfilters use DKIM and SPF *too* for their scoring
cat maillog | grep "spamd: result" | grep DKIM | wc -l 12782
/var/lib/spamassassin/3.004000/updates_spamassassin_org score USER_IN_DKIM_WHITELIST -100.000 score USER_IN_DEF_DKIM_WL -7.500 score DKIM_SIGNED 0.1 score DKIM_VALID -0.1 score DKIM_VALID_AU -0.1 score DKIM_VERIFIED 0 score DKIM_POLICY_SIGNALL 0 score DKIM_POLICY_SIGNSOME 0 score DKIM_POLICY_TESTING 0 score DKIM_ADSP_CUSTOM_LOW 0.001 score DKIM_ADSP_CUSTOM_MED 0.001 score DKIM_ADSP_CUSTOM_HIGH 0.001 score DKIM_ADSP_ALL 0 1.1 0 0.8 score DKIM_ADSP_DISCARD 0 1.8 0 1.8 score DKIM_ADSP_NXDOMAIN 0 0.8 0 0.9 score DKIMDOMAIN_IN_DWL 0 -3.5 0 -3.5 score DKIMDOMAIN_IN_DWL_UNKNOWN 0 -0.01 0 -0.01
Am 14.10.2014 um 11:40 schrieb Moritz Augsburger:
On 2014-10-14 11:37, Reindl Harald wrote:
nonsense because that spamfilters use DKIM and SPF *too* for their scoring
Sorry, didn't know that spamasassin is the only available spam filter on the market
no, but most others work similar and SA works behind the scenes even in most commercial boxes as one of many filters - the point was that many people using DKIM for their filtering without even aware
Professa Dementia wrote:
On 10/14/2014 1:28 AM, Jorge Bastos wrote:
Also the [Dovecot] on the subject would be handy.
The list used to do this. I agree with you, and the matter was debated, but the list is not a democracy and Timo, as the owner, changed the list unilaterally.
The problem is that changing the subject conflicts with DKIM. DKIM is a broken standard for several reasons; it does not have allowances for mailing lists to add their name to the subject - a very common and useful practice
And superfluous too - for list identification, use the List-* headers instead.
- and these days spam filters do a far superior job than DKIM, making it too little, too late. I do not use DKIM and get no spam.
I don't use DKIM, and I get loads of spam :-) As always, YMMV.
-- Per Jessen, Zürich (0.0°C) http://www.dns24.ch/ - your free DNS host, made in Switzerland.
On 14 Oct 2014, at 01:28, Jorge Bastos mysql.jorge@decimal.pt wrote:
Is it possible to change the reply-to in mailman to be the list, and not the person who replied?
I've a patched mailman that allows you to set the reply-to headers to your mails, indicating that you want replies only to list. See the "edit options" in http://dovecot.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/dovecot
I sometimes (well, nowadays probably too often) reply to mails very late, and I always do reply-to-all then, because there's a good chance that the person who originally sent the mail isn't actively reading Dovecot list and would miss the reply otherwise. Also when I'm in other mailing lists I prefer people to Cc me, because I'm not actively reading any of those lists and I could easily miss the reply.
But people are different and want different things. I don't know if there's any good solution to this. Except maybe if everybody always did reply-to-all and people could start configuring their mail clients in a way to hide the private replies if they don't want to see them.
Also the [Dovecot] on the subject would be handy.
As mentioned, this breaks DKIM. You could create a local Sieve script to add the [Dovecot] subject.
Perfect :)
-----Original Message----- From: dovecot [mailto:dovecot-bounces@dovecot.org] On Behalf Of Timo Sirainen Sent: terça-feira, 14 de Outubro de 2014 18:08 To: Dovecot Mailing List Subject: Re: Request to list owner
On 14 Oct 2014, at 01:28, Jorge Bastos mysql.jorge@decimal.pt wrote:
Is it possible to change the reply-to in mailman to be the list, and not the person who replied?
I've a patched mailman that allows you to set the reply-to headers to your mails, indicating that you want replies only to list. See the "edit options" in http://dovecot.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/dovecot
I sometimes (well, nowadays probably too often) reply to mails very late, and I always do reply-to-all then, because there's a good chance that the person who originally sent the mail isn't actively reading Dovecot list and would miss the reply otherwise. Also when I'm in other mailing lists I prefer people to Cc me, because I'm not actively reading any of those lists and I could easily miss the reply.
But people are different and want different things. I don't know if there's any good solution to this. Except maybe if everybody always did reply-to-all and people could start configuring their mail clients in a way to hide the private replies if they don't want to see them.
Also the [Dovecot] on the subject would be handy.
As mentioned, this breaks DKIM. You could create a local Sieve script to add the [Dovecot] subject.
On Die, 2014-10-14 at 09:28 +0100, Jorge Bastos wrote: [...]
Sorry for this.
Than don't write it.
Is it possible to change the reply-to in mailman to be the list, and not the person who replied?
Alas, it is possible but not good: http://www.unicom.com/pw/reply-to-harmful.html https://woozle.org/~neale/papers/reply-to-still-harmful.html
Also the [Dovecot] on the subject would be handy.
That wastes screen space and mail filtering is - in the 21st century - better done on List-Id and similar headers.
Just two things to get better.
No, much much worse.
Bernd-- "I dislike type abstraction if it has no real reason. And saving on typing is not a good reason - if your typing speed is the main issue when you're coding, you're doing something seriously wrong." - Linus Torvalds
participants (10)
-
Bernd Petrovitsch
-
Jorge Bastos
-
Moritz Augsburger
-
Per Jessen
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Professa Dementia
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Przemysław Orzechowski
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Reindl Harald
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Robert Schetterer
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Steve Litt
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Timo Sirainen