spam folder and POP users
I am new to actually running dovecot. I actually still use POP as I have for YEARS and thunderbird does not make it easy to convert to IMAP...
My server is moving all tagged spam into the IMAP spam folder. Very nice for the IMAP users, but not for the POP users. Of course the server don't know, and the mysql database for users does not have any flags for this. Don't want my server to fill up with spam from POP users that don't know to check via IMAP.
I am using roundcubemail for the webmail IMAP client. Is there any way for POP users to indicate that they do not want spam so nicely auto moved to the IMAP spam folder?
Am 20.11.2014 um 23:29 schrieb Robert Moskowitz:
I am new to actually running dovecot. I actually still use POP as I have for YEARS and thunderbird does not make it easy to convert to IMAP...
My server is moving all tagged spam into the IMAP spam folder. Very nice for the IMAP users, but not for the POP users. Of course the server don't know, and the mysql database for users does not have any flags for this. Don't want my server to fill up with spam from POP users that don't know to check via IMAP.
I am using roundcubemail for the webmail IMAP client. Is there any way for POP users to indicate that they do not want spam so nicely auto moved to the IMAP spam folder?
dovecot just don't know if it is a "POP3 user" it is just a user
what about setup a better spam filter so you can deliver the 5-10 spam messages just to INBOX with [SPAM] added to the subject?
to give you some numbers: 1200 users, 150 flagged messages per day
On 11/20/2014 05:35 PM, Reindl Harald wrote:
Am 20.11.2014 um 23:29 schrieb Robert Moskowitz:
I am new to actually running dovecot. I actually still use POP as I have for YEARS and thunderbird does not make it easy to convert to IMAP...
My server is moving all tagged spam into the IMAP spam folder. Very nice for the IMAP users, but not for the POP users. Of course the server don't know, and the mysql database for users does not have any flags for this. Don't want my server to fill up with spam from POP users that don't know to check via IMAP.
I am using roundcubemail for the webmail IMAP client. Is there any way for POP users to indicate that they do not want spam so nicely auto moved to the IMAP spam folder?
dovecot just don't know if it is a "POP3 user"
That I know. Though since it is using a mysql database of users, I COULD add a column designating this. But it would be difficult to maintain. Better perhaps for dovecot NOT to be so nice to move the messages and leave that to the client.
it is just a user
what about setup a better spam filter so you can deliver the 5-10 spam messages just to INBOX with [SPAM] added to the subject?
Well ***SPAM*** is added to the subject. And it seems that dovecot is being really nice to act on that and move it. Now I have to remember what I did to configure this and unconfigure this. I did much of the work long ago, set it aside, built a new box,,, So now I am learning what I did.
to give you some numbers: 1200 users, 150 flagged messages per day
I only have 12 users. Small time, I know. And some have 1000 flagged messages per day.
Am 20.11.2014 um 23:43 schrieb Robert Moskowitz:
On 11/20/2014 05:35 PM, Reindl Harald wrote:
Am 20.11.2014 um 23:29 schrieb Robert Moskowitz:
I am new to actually running dovecot. I actually still use POP as I have for YEARS and thunderbird does not make it easy to convert to IMAP...
My server is moving all tagged spam into the IMAP spam folder. Very nice for the IMAP users, but not for the POP users. Of course the server don't know, and the mysql database for users does not have any flags for this. Don't want my server to fill up with spam from POP users that don't know to check via IMAP.
I am using roundcubemail for the webmail IMAP client. Is there any way for POP users to indicate that they do not want spam so nicely auto moved to the IMAP spam folder?
dovecot just don't know if it is a "POP3 user"
That I know. Though since it is using a mysql database of users, I COULD add a column designating this. But it would be difficult to maintain. Better perhaps for dovecot NOT to be so nice to move the messages and leave that to the client.
exactly - it's not maintainable and from the moment on you offer webmail it's done at all
it is just a user
what about setup a better spam filter so you can deliver the 5-10 spam messages just to INBOX with [SPAM] added to the subject?
Well ***SPAM*** is added to the subject
it's worthless just add a prefix to a high-score spam with a score of 47 instead *reject* it via *milter* X-Spam-Status: No, score=-7.8, tag-level=5.5, block-level=8.0
And it seems that dovecot is being really nice to act on that and move it. Now I have to remember what I did to configure this and unconfigure this
just remove the sieve rule you have active, dovecot never ever moves anything around until someone said so
On 21 Nov 2014, at 07:43, Robert Moskowitz rgm@htt-consult.com wrote:
Better perhaps for dovecot NOT to be so nice to move the messages and leave that to the client.
Dovecot doesn't move anything anywhere, unless either the IMAP client requests that or the admin has configured that (e.g. with Sieve).
On 11/20/2014 05:29 PM, Robert Moskowitz wrote:
I am new to actually running dovecot. I actually still use POP as I have for YEARS and thunderbird does not make it easy to convert to IMAP...
My server is moving all tagged spam into the IMAP spam folder. Very nice for the IMAP users, but not for the POP users. Of course the server don't know, and the mysql database for users does not have any flags for this. Don't want my server to fill up with spam from POP users that don't know to check via IMAP.
I am using roundcubemail for the webmail IMAP client. Is there any way for POP users to indicate that they do not want spam so nicely auto moved to the IMAP spam folder?
How do you even define a "pop user" - it's not an easy thing to determine. Someone who hasn't logged in via IMAP in x days? Perhaps implement a lastlogin_imap field? You really should just have a flag in your database. Otherwise, just purge from the spam folder messages older than X days (preferably after notifying the users, of course). Another (rather annoying) feature some people have is to have a "spam report" delivered to Inbox daily, listing messages delivered to Spam in the past 24 hours, you can script that around doveadm fetch.
On 11/20/2014 05:37 PM, Gedalya wrote:
On 11/20/2014 05:29 PM, Robert Moskowitz wrote:
I am new to actually running dovecot. I actually still use POP as I have for YEARS and thunderbird does not make it easy to convert to IMAP...
My server is moving all tagged spam into the IMAP spam folder. Very nice for the IMAP users, but not for the POP users. Of course the server don't know, and the mysql database for users does not have any flags for this. Don't want my server to fill up with spam from POP users that don't know to check via IMAP.
I am using roundcubemail for the webmail IMAP client. Is there any way for POP users to indicate that they do not want spam so nicely auto moved to the IMAP spam folder?
How do you even define a "pop user" - it's not an easy thing to determine.
Some that connects to port 110 using a POP3 client. Remember those?
Back to the days of Eudora, perhaps? Pete Resnick still attends IETF.
Of course one time they attach with POP3, another with IMAP so I did find out what I did and now I have to decide what to do about it. Problem with taking such a big move in one, and then seeing how it works. Or not.
Someone who hasn't logged in via IMAP in x days? Perhaps implement a lastlogin_imap field? You really should just have a flag in your database. Otherwise, just purge from the spam folder messages older than X days (preferably after notifying the users, of course).
Something to think about. Might be good for those that are not IMAP users.
Another (rather annoying) feature some people have is to have a "spam report" delivered to Inbox daily, listing messages delivered to Spam in the past 24 hours, you can script that around doveadm fetch.
but basically the above purge would result in a daily message: "I am going to purge old spam if you don't do it yourself".
On 11/20/2014 05:29 PM, Robert Moskowitz wrote:
I am new to actually running dovecot. I actually still use POP as I have for YEARS and thunderbird does not make it easy to convert to IMAP...
My server is moving all tagged spam into the IMAP spam folder. Very nice for the IMAP users, but not for the POP users. Of course the server don't know, and the mysql database for users does not have any flags for this. Don't want my server to fill up with spam from POP users that don't know to check via IMAP.
I am using roundcubemail for the webmail IMAP client. Is there any way for POP users to indicate that they do not want spam so nicely auto moved to the IMAP spam folder?
Obviously I picked this up and did not think through the results. Seemed good at the time... mkdir /home/sieve cat <<EOF>/home/sieve/globalfilter.sieve || exit 1 require "fileinto"; if exists "X-Spam-Flag" { if header :contains "X-Spam-Flag" "NO" { } else { fileinto "Spam"; stop; } } if header :contains "subject" ["***SPAM***"] { fileinto "Spam"; stop; } EOF chown -R vmail:mail /home/sieve ============================================ So one option is just to disable this. Another is to work out how each user can do this if they want...
On 11/20/2014 05:51 PM, Robert Moskowitz wrote:
On 11/20/2014 05:29 PM, Robert Moskowitz wrote:
I am new to actually running dovecot. I actually still use POP as I have for YEARS and thunderbird does not make it easy to convert to IMAP...
My server is moving all tagged spam into the IMAP spam folder. Very nice for the IMAP users, but not for the POP users. Of course the server don't know, and the mysql database for users does not have any flags for this. Don't want my server to fill up with spam from POP users that don't know to check via IMAP.
I am using roundcubemail for the webmail IMAP client. Is there any way for POP users to indicate that they do not want spam so nicely auto moved to the IMAP spam folder?
Obviously I picked this up and did not think through the results. Seemed good at the time...
mkdir /home/sieve cat <<EOF>/home/sieve/globalfilter.sieve || exit 1 require "fileinto"; if exists "X-Spam-Flag" { if header :contains "X-Spam-Flag" "NO" { } else { fileinto "Spam"; stop; } } if header :contains "subject" ["***SPAM***"] { fileinto "Spam"; stop; } EOF
chown -R vmail:mail /home/sieve
============================================
So one option is just to disable this. Another is to work out how each user can do this if they want...
You're already using roundcube, so just enable managesieve and the roundcube managesieve plugin, and let every user configure for themselves how to react to the X-Spam-Flag header. You can drop in a few sieve scripts as suggestions and they can enable the one they like, or none, if they prefer to use their local mail client for sorting this out.
On 11/20/2014 05:57 PM, Gedalya wrote:
On 11/20/2014 05:51 PM, Robert Moskowitz wrote:
On 11/20/2014 05:29 PM, Robert Moskowitz wrote:
I am new to actually running dovecot. I actually still use POP as I have for YEARS and thunderbird does not make it easy to convert to IMAP...
My server is moving all tagged spam into the IMAP spam folder. Very nice for the IMAP users, but not for the POP users. Of course the server don't know, and the mysql database for users does not have any flags for this. Don't want my server to fill up with spam from POP users that don't know to check via IMAP.
I am using roundcubemail for the webmail IMAP client. Is there any way for POP users to indicate that they do not want spam so nicely auto moved to the IMAP spam folder?
Obviously I picked this up and did not think through the results. Seemed good at the time...
mkdir /home/sieve cat <<EOF>/home/sieve/globalfilter.sieve || exit 1 require "fileinto"; if exists "X-Spam-Flag" { if header :contains "X-Spam-Flag" "NO" { } else { fileinto "Spam"; stop; } } if header :contains "subject" ["***SPAM***"] { fileinto "Spam"; stop; } EOF
chown -R vmail:mail /home/sieve
============================================
So one option is just to disable this. Another is to work out how each user can do this if they want...
You're already using roundcube, so just enable managesieve and the roundcube managesieve plugin, and let every user configure for themselves how to react to the X-Spam-Flag header. You can drop in a few sieve scripts as suggestions and they can enable the one they like, or none, if they prefer to use their local mail client for sorting this out.
I was just figuring that out. Kind of tossed everything into the sink and now I have to sort it out. Let the IMAP users (most likely Roundcube) deal with it themselves and let the POP3 users continue to get their spam to eat.
On Thu, 20 Nov 2014 17:29:05 -0500 Robert Moskowitz wrote:
[ ... ]
I am using roundcubemail for the webmail IMAP client. Is there any way for POP users to indicate that they do not want spam so nicely auto moved to the IMAP spam folder?
Mixing POP and IMAP is really bad due to many reasons. Peopla always complain "where is my mail" when using a web interface after they have POPped at home.
You should consider to switch off POP. POP is for people living in caves.
Greeting, Frank
Am 21.11.2014 um 08:50 schrieb Frank Elsner:
On Thu, 20 Nov 2014 17:29:05 -0500 Robert Moskowitz wrote:
I am using roundcubemail for the webmail IMAP client. Is there any way for POP users to indicate that they do not want spam so nicely auto moved to the IMAP spam folder?
Mixing POP and IMAP is really bad due to many reasons. Peopla always complain "where is my mail" when using a web interface after they have POPped at home.
You should consider to switch off POP. POP is for people living in caves
no - it's for non-technical people not understanding that the trash folder also lives on the server and just delete messages aka move them in a different folder don't solve the quota warning
we sometimes consider to switch IMAP off if there would not be a few accounts where it really makes sense and not only work and problems
that said from somebody with currently 40 shared IMAP folders using it heavily
Am 21.11.2014 um 09:34 schrieb Reindl Harald:
Am 21.11.2014 um 08:50 schrieb Frank Elsner:
On Thu, 20 Nov 2014 17:29:05 -0500 Robert Moskowitz wrote:
I am using roundcubemail for the webmail IMAP client. Is there any way for POP users to indicate that they do not want spam so nicely auto moved to the IMAP spam folder?
Mixing POP and IMAP is really bad due to many reasons. Peopla always complain "where is my mail" when using a web interface after they have POPped at home.
You should consider to switch off POP. POP is for people living in caves
no - it's for non-technical people not understanding that the trash folder also lives on the server and just delete messages aka move them in a different folder don't solve the quota warning
we sometimes consider to switch IMAP off if there would not be a few accounts where it really makes sense and not only work and problems
that said from somebody with currently 40 shared IMAP folders using it heavily
however, use virtual folder setup with pop3 and global sieve rule for filtering
see
https://sys4.de/de/blog/2013/02/11/dovecot-virtual-setup-mit-globaler-sieve-...
sorry german but config should speak for its own
Best Regards MfG Robert Schetterer
-- [*] sys4 AG
http://sys4.de, +49 (89) 30 90 46 64 Franziskanerstraße 15, 81669 München
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participants (6)
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Frank Elsner
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Gedalya
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Reindl Harald
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Robert Moskowitz
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Robert Schetterer
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Timo Sirainen